Replacing canvas?

ChetPunisher

Curious about Wooden Canoes
I have an opportunity to purchase an older old town. Canvas is toast. Is there a walk thru or a resource you guys could suggest?
 
There are a lot of great places to start...

http://store.wcha.org/This-Old-Canoe-by-Mike-Elliott.html
http://store.wcha.org/The-Wood-and-Canvas-Canoe.html (referred to often as "The Bible Of Wood/Canvas Canoe Restoration")
No longer listed in the WCHA store is "Building the Maine Guide Canoe" by Jerry Stelmok. Look on eBay, or any other used book resource.

The books will get you in the ball park, and if you read them carefully, may get you all the way to "done." Ask questions here; people are very happy to share information. Find your local WCHA Chapter here: http://www.wcha.org/local-area-chapters/ You may end up canvassing it with a committee of highly skilled restorers, at a local WCHA event... you just never know...
 
If you had to choose one of those three books, which would you suggest?

I'll post pics tonight after I pick it up.
 
There is a YouTube channel (Orca Boats I believe) that has some great videos on canvas replacement using fairly traditional methods. He uses a water-based mastic for canvas filling that seems to speed up the process a little bit. The old style filler works well but takes a very long time to cure.

If you are not totally concerned with originality, you can use Ceconite instead. It's extremely durable and tear resistant. Very forgiving to install as well if you are a first timer - you can leave it a bit loose/puckered and use a heat gun to shrink it up tight/eliminate wrinkles. Seams will need to be sealed with dope and pinking tape. The entire surface can also be primed with dope prior to painting. The end result will be a bit smoother (less visible grain) than canvas and a tad lighter.

Both are good options, but the learning curve is a bit shorter with Ceconite.
 
There is a bit more to be said about the choice between polyester (Ceconite or Dacron) -- a search on these forums will lead to quite a bit more information.

Among other things:

Because the polyester fabric used on canoes is much thinner, any unfairness (bumps, plank seams, etc.) in the hull is more likely to show through on the finished boat than with canvas/filler, which is a thicker material. This is less of an issue on a new hull, and much more of an issue on an older hull being restored.

And “visible grain” (I presume this means the woven texture of the cloth) is almost never an issue with filled and painted canvas. A perfectly smooth, grain-free finish is the norm for a canvas-covered hull.

Filled canvas is very durable, and is less prone to ripping than is polyester. Neither is bulletproof. Filled canvas is generally considered to be more durable -- a price to be paid for its heavier weight.

There are other issues also, such as repairing, touching up paint scratches, etc. etc. etc.

Concern with “originality” is not the only reason most people continue to re-cover canoes with canvas and most contemporary canoe builders usually still use canvas when building a new canoe.
 
I'm no authority as I just started doing my first restoration. I bought 3 old timers that will challenge me every step of the way as they are all pretty beat up (one of them, dubbed the PT 109 has been cut in two). So if you want the opinion of a fellow novice, here goes. I bought three: Jerry Stelmok's book, Mike Elliot's and Joe Seliga's. All three have a lot of info and pictures. Mike Elliot's is more suited toward restoration but the more info for me the better. Also, there are a lot of videos on Youtube that give a lot of instruction. Orca has some good ones. and there are a ton of experts on this site. I read here all the time. I'm not a great woodworker/cabinet maker but I know which end of the hammer to hit my thumb with. I'm finding that patience is the key. Lots of it mixed with elbow grease and thought. Good luck. It is a lot of fun.
john m
 
Thanks for creating that playlist as I have been meaning to put those in order for some time. I have also done it on my channel.

My pleasure Rod. I imagine you're rather busy so no worries.

IIRC the series on the cedar strip build didn't have a completion video. I enjoy your work very much, btw and would love to see the end of that build.
 
Wow! Thanks for posting those clips! I will be picking up my Chestnut Pal next week and am sure that a canvas job will be in my future as well.
 
Glad I could help.

Maybe the video links are worthy of being Pinned or Stickied or some such?
 
From the comments above re dacron vs canvas, does the canvas weight figure into the issue of smoothly covering an older hull ? Or is it the difference in durability ? I'm at the pre-canvas-order stage for an original B. N. Morris, which will be my first canvas project.
 
From what I have read, dacron will typically save 10 pounds, +/_, over filed canvas.

In no particular order, the main factors to be juggled are weight, smoothness, durability, and time to apply (many canvas fillers take a month or more to cure). What is "best" depends on the relative value you give to each of these factors, keeping in mind how you will use the canoe.

In my particular case, I have found that all canoes weigh more as I age (I'm in my 70's) so I weigh "weight" more than I once would, and since I have found the 20 foot test to be the appropriate test for judging appearance, I also weigh "smoothness" less than I once might have. Different strokes for different folks.

Greg
 
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