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Help identify canoe

Discussion in 'Wood and Canvas' started by fred capenos, Nov 13, 2013.

  1. fred capenos

    fred capenos Canoe Pilot

    Trying to post photos again
     

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    Last edited: Nov 13, 2013
  2. Dave Wermuth

    Dave Wermuth Who hid my paddle?

    The clipped rib tips look Thompson esque. As do the hardware and the seats. but the drop down dowels don't say Thompson to me.
     
  3. Gil Cramer

    Gil Cramer The wooden canoe Shop, Inc.

    Double bolts in the thwart, and shoe keel suggest Canadian, but I do not know what this canoe is. It doesn't look like a Kennebec.
     
  4. OP
    OP
    fred capenos

    fred capenos Canoe Pilot

    I better get everything on the same post. I had to re-learn how to post pictures.

    This canoe was purchased used in 1936. It's 16' long, beam is 33" and 12 1/2 " deep' ribs are 2" wide, 3/8 thick, tapered and chamfered at the tips. Planking is horizontal. D shaped outwales, shoe keel and the deck height is apx. 23" There is no metal strap under the deck but a lot looks Thompson to me. Could it be an early Indian mode? Thanks in advance. Fred
     
  5. Dan Lindberg

    Dan Lindberg Ex Wood Hoarder

    I vote Thompson, and early with those high, old style pointed ends.

    Dan
     
  6. Andre Cloutier

    Andre Cloutier Firestarter. Wicked Firestarter.

    Looks like an earlier Canadian boat, tapered ribs with a Peterborough deck like a model 604 or such (Old Town HW deck copy). Maybe built by Canadian Canoe Co as it seems to have full size ribs up the ends, not the usual 3inch can ribs. Couple more pics of ends and cants, and thwart placement should do it. Looks nice.
     
  7. OP
    OP
    fred capenos

    fred capenos Canoe Pilot

    Here's some more photos ... I'll try to get a full size interior shot tomorrow
     

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  8. Dave Wermuth

    Dave Wermuth Who hid my paddle?

    Does the planking run like Thompsons? I've only seen those 45 degree clipped rib top corners on Thompson. Don't thompsons have metal bands under the deck? to hold inwales together at construction?
     
  9. Dan Miller

    Dan Miller cranky canoeist Staff Member

    Racine Boat Company also clipped the rib corners.

    Thompsons also usually (always?) had non-tapered inwales.
     
  10. Paul Miller

    Paul Miller Canoe Nut

    I've attached a pic of my Racine long deck showing ribs with the clipped corners and no taper to the ribs.

    The ribs on the subject canoe also appear to be much closer together than most I've seen.

    I'll go with Canadian.

    Paul
     

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  11. Dave Wermuth

    Dave Wermuth Who hid my paddle?

    learn something everyday. If only I could remember it. thanks.
     
  12. Gil Cramer

    Gil Cramer The wooden canoe Shop, Inc.

    I almost hate to write this,but some Kennebec canoes had clipped rib tips. This is not one of them.
     
  13. OP
    OP
    fred capenos

    fred capenos Canoe Pilot

    Here's a few more bits of information

    The deck is mortised onto the stem unlike a Thompson. There are 2 sets of cant ribs that are almost straight. The space between the cant ribs at their widest point is less than 1-1/4 inch. The first 5 ribs that are not under the stem have such a sharp bend they look like they are broken, but they aren't. As seen in the photo, this canoe has a very sharp entry. Also, it has the tightest planking I've ever seen on a canoe.
     

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  14. davelanthier

    davelanthier Wooden Canoes are in the Blood

    Your canoe has most of the exact same features as my Peterborough 604 including the decks, tapered inwales, sharply bent ribs beyond the stem end, clipped rib tips, gap free planking, narrow cant ribs. All my ribs are 1 1/2" non- tapered but that may not mean much if these canoes are of different production years? Have you stripped the deck paint to see if there is any evidence under it?
     
  15. davelanthier

    davelanthier Wooden Canoes are in the Blood

    Here's a few photos of my Peterborough 604. Hope they help.
     

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  16. OP
    OP
    fred capenos

    fred capenos Canoe Pilot

    Dave, Thanks for the reply. I think there is hope we may be able to identify this canoe. I found your original post and read all the replies. I didn't post that this canoe doesn't have Robertson screws. Does your canoe have slotted screws? Any signs of a shoe keel? I haven't stripped the deck yet, not sure how to do that without losing anything that's under it... do you have any ideas? Did I mentioned that it's been fiberglassed?? We plan to remove the fiberglass at our first winter project meeting.
    Looks like Andre may be right...it being a Canadian Canoe Company.

    Thanks everyone for your input...Fred
     
  17. davelanthier

    davelanthier Wooden Canoes are in the Blood

    Hi Fred, my canoe has a shoe keel and all the screws are slotted brass, not Robertson. Not sure when the Canadian canoe companies went to Robertson screws, suspect it was in the 1940's. I think I would use a chemical stripper on the deck, tough call though. A heat gun or careful scraping/sanding might also be the way to go??? Chances are that you won't find a decal but hopefully you can find a factory decal shadow on the wood surface and/or 2 small nail holes from a brass serial plate.
     
  18. Andre Cloutier

    Andre Cloutier Firestarter. Wicked Firestarter.

    Fred, my Canadian will literally float without canvas, very tight and they are very well built, especially the early ones. Normal ribs rather than wide thin cants are usual too.
     
  19. davelanthier

    davelanthier Wooden Canoes are in the Blood

    Here's another Peterborough 604

    Had this one awhile ago. I had the removed the brass factory serial number plate from the deck prior to taking the pictures. This canoe ended up on the Canadian Pickers TV show. Note the ribs. Of possible interest too is that this canoe with it's tapered ribs had a serial number of 9444 where as my PB 604 with non-tapered ribs has a serial number of 6390. No numbers were found anywhere else on these canoes except the brass deck plate.
     

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    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  20. OP
    OP
    fred capenos

    fred capenos Canoe Pilot

    Dave, Andre, and all others who helped on this one. Thank You! One more little fact. All three 604 pictures that we've seen and the one in question have the same painter rings located in the same place. At this point I'm convinced.

    Here's a side note: This canoe has been in the owners family since the late 30s. She has joined both the WCHA and the Three Rivers chapter. Then she brought in another person that has an Old Town in need of restoration and he is also joining. Thanks. From All of us
     

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